Jane Crowe on Grit, Culture, and Leading Authentically

Jane Crowe didn't plan her career. She worked at McDonald's while doing a double degree at Canterbury University. She's been managing people since she was 18.

Then she took a sales rep job at Janssen Cilag instead of a cigarette company. Started in New Zealand. Got posted to Beijing through J&J's International Development Program. Moved to Australia with two suitcases and no plan.

30 years later, Jane's the Vice President APAC for Cardinal Health. She's run organisations through crises, scaled teams across time zones, and learned what it really takes to lead at this level.

In this episode, Jane shares:

The Beijing moment: Six months into her posting in China, Jane sat in a hotel room watching a research group discuss athlete's foot through a glass wall. She spoke no Mandarin. She was accountable for the project. She went back to her hotel, sat on the floor, and cried. Then she got up the next day, found a Mandarin teacher, and gritted it out. "I wasn't going to let it beat me. The more you do, the more you know it's not gonna kill you."

8 interviews and the one question that mattered: Jane did 8 interviews for Cardinal Health. The then-Global Head asked about her career aspirations. Jane said: "When I'm 80, I want to be running the local bowls club." After he stopped laughing, he said: "What I tell my team is, after they've spent time with their family and their sport and their community, whatever's left is what they bring back into the business." That told Jane everything about the culture.

How to read culture in interviews: "An interview works both ways. Ask if you can meet with others in the organisation, not just senior leadership. Ask specific questions about how they handle things — how the organisation adapted through COVID, for example. That tells you how they treat their people."

Correct vs. right: "There's decisions that are correct, and there's decisions that are right. And knowing the difference between the two. I used to make correct decisions based on data. I'm now leaning more into what is right."

How she disarms people in interviews: "By the time the interviewee gets to me, we've gone through all the skills and attributes. I try to unpick them a little bit and get them to relax. I make them talk about family and sport. Anyone can fake the normal interview. I want to get to know who you are as an individual and what makes you tick."

The year of learning: Jane chooses one thing to focus on each year. One year was quality (ISO leadership course). One year was governance (AICD company directors course). One year was privacy and cybersecurity. This year? AI.

The stopwatch trap: "I see people running their career with a stopwatch. 'I've done this role for two years. Now what?' That's very linear. What about building a parallel career path through board roles?"

Board roles and giving back: Jane's held multiple unpaid board roles — vice president for a community transport organisation, president for a childcare organisation, and vice president for the MTAA. "I've learned more from those than I have from my paid work."

What's next: Jane's leading Cardinal Health's APAC region, launching new products in nutritional delivery (Kangaroo Omni) and compression (Kendall Smart Flow), and bringing their sustainable technologies business to Australia.

Jane's story is a masterclass in grit, resilience, and leading with your authentic voice.

Transcript

Tara: [00:00:00] So I'm very excited today to welcome Jane Crowe, who I think needs no introduction from Cardinal Health. But I'd love you to introduce yourself to our audience and tell us a bit about you now and your career journey.

Jane: Wow. Thank you so much. Thank you Tara. Yeah, look, I feel very humbled with that introduction. So my name is Jane Crowe. I am vice President for Cardinal Health for APAC region. I am brand new in the role, so I 

commenced in this role, brand new. 

I commenced in this role from the 1st of July, but goodness hasn't time flown.

Tara: Yeah, 

Jane: I've been with Cardinal Health now for coming up to five years. Most recently before this role I was managing director for Australia and New Zealand. 

Tara: Yeah, excellent. That's very exciting and very new, like you say. So, I'm really 

Jane: It is,

Tara: Excited that we get to talk to you at this point of your career journey.

So lets, just talk to us a little bit about your career journey into the industry and then through to this very, senior leadership executive position. Now, [00:01:00] 

Jane: I love this question. It implies that the career journey is somehow linear and planned. And it could be it's nothing of the sort. So look, I don't want this to sound like a job interview where I go through my resume, but I did kind of think about the journey and to your question, how I ended up in this role and what sort of I suppose what I picked up along the way and how this came about.

So I'm a New Zealander. Can you hear it in the accent? 

Tara: Just, 

Jane: There we go just. So I'm a New Zealander I studied at Canterbury University and look, I wanna point out at this point in time that, I was doing a double degree at Canterbury University, but working at McDonald's at the same time, and I cannot emphasize if you are young and you're listening to this or you have children, I'm going to say get a job.

Tara: Yeah, 

Jane: Get a job, learn the value of work, money, those things are so important. Why am I mentioning this? Because I was assistant store manager working 40 hours a week doing a double degree at university. 

Tara: Wow. 

Jane: So I thought about this [00:02:00] because I've been managing people since I was 18. 

Tara: Wow. 

Jane: That's a really long time.

There's a lot of mistakes made in there, so a lot of experience. But I remember being 18 years old, managing people who were twice my age and the learnings that came from that. So there's that. It probably also gives you some insight into my work ethic. I'm gonna blame my parents for that.

Tara. They're retired now and they're the sort of people, I think, you know what I mean? We can all relate to this. They're the sort of people who never sit still. Okay. The ones that never sit still, they're always in the garden or doing something. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: Or involved aren't traveling.

So, it's their fault. No. But yeah, I, take from that the work ethic and I can see that in my brother and that I think I'm so lucky that's what they instilled in me and it's continued to this day. So any thought that I've ever stopped working at that pace, if that makes sense.

I, just don't, yeah. I seem to just fill time. 

Tara: Yeah. 

So yeah, that's, that tells you a lot about me in that, in one. How did [00:03:00] I land in the industry? 

Yeah. 

Jane: I'd been traveling as all good New Zealanders do when we finished university. And I ended up in a position where I was interviewing for two different roles.

One was a sales rep for a cigarette company, I cannot remember which one. And the other one was Janssen Cilag, which the time was pharmaceutical division of J&J. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: And here we all are. It could have been there you go, there's your sliding doors moment. And what do I remember from that?

Pete, who was the sales manager from j and j, who was interviewing me at the time, I think he said something to the extent of, look, the fact that you've done a double degree, Jane, fantastic, but you worked at McDonald's. What does that tell me about you? It tells me that you've been able to communicate with people work within processes, teams and I've taken that with me.

I really have. I think that's been really good advice in life. So I was with J&J in New Zealand for a period of time promoted within, I was sales rep in the south island. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: Promoted. I've got a feeling it was about 14 [00:04:00] or 15 months. It wasn't long. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: And my manager in Auckland she recommended me for her role.

And so I moved up to Auckland. I was there for a few years managing the team, did my first television commercials. I was doing infomercials at the time. Can't believe it. Took products into supermarkets, managed a sales team as well. And then I have a sense that J&J probably didn't know what to do with me at that point, and they had something at the time.

I think they still do. They have something called the International Development Program or IDP. 

Tara: Okay. 

Jane: Where they take individuals and they give them an opportunity, usually two years to work overseas. And I was incredibly fortunate. They offered, there were two roles that were on the table.

One was in the US in Pennsylvania, can you imagine it? 

Tara: Right. 

Jane: And the other one was in China. 

Wow. 

In Beijing. And again, this tells you a lot about my decision making. I took the role in China. And so I was based in Beijing for two years. Fantastic opportunity. Just the deep end. 

Tara: Yeah.

Jane: Absolutely [00:05:00] loved it. And it was hard. It was really hard. At the end of that two year period, there was no parachute. So J&J had made it really clear that they couldn't hold a role open for me in a place like New Zealand. You understand that? 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: And I was young, so completely fine with that decision.

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: And happened to be at a meeting in China and I ran into the managing director of, Janssen Cilag here in Australia. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: And he said, Jane, would you like to come back to Sydney? I've got a product that I'd like to launch. You wanna come and give us a hand? That's pretty much how I ended up in Australia.

There you go. With two suitcases and no grand plan after that. 

Tara: Wow. 

Jane: I arrived in Sydney with maybe one or two friends from university that I knew. And yeah, threw myself at a role. It was in the antipsychotic portfolio. Absolutely loved that. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: Loved that so much. Just as a specialty area, absolutely fascinating.

But I think I'd come out of China and everything was really hard. I know that sounds like a strange thing to say, but it all felt a lit, the pace was [00:06:00] different 

Tara: In China or in Australia? 

Jane: In Australia, 

Tara: yeah. Okay. 

Jane: So I talk to a lot of people who've been expats and they talk about the challenge of arriving in a different country, but it's returning.

That's harder. Many expats will agree with me in that, because you are different. Yeah. And you expect maybe that I don't know what it is that you are returning from somewhere difficult or working in a challenging environment and somehow or other you miss that. 

Tara: Yeah. Right. 

Jane: I don't know quite how to explain that.

You'll have to talk to other expats, but it is a conversation I have often with them, which is it's harder to return than it is to go. Maybe there's the adrenaline rush of arriving in a new city that keeps you Voyant. 

Tara: I think it's interesting, right? 'cause every time I go back. The UK.

Jane: Yeah. 

Tara: I've lived in, well obviously from the uk then lived in Singapore.

I've lived in New York, New Zealand, and then settled in Australia. 

Jane: Yeah. 

Tara: And when I go back to England, nothing has changed. And that's the piece that I find challenging. 

Jane: But you have changed. 

Tara: But you've changed a lot. 

Jane: Yes. 

Tara: And sometimes there's a [00:07:00] stability in that and other times it just, it isn't enough for me anymore.

Jane: No, friendships, 

Tara: maybe something like that, everything changes a bit for you internally. 

Jane: Look, I suppose it's different at different times in your life. But at the time I found that challenging. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: And I think as much as I loved my job and by that stage I'd been working for j and j in total for probably about seven years, I started to look for other roles.

And I figured out pretty quickly that they were all the same sort of thing, working for a different company. 

Tara: Yep. 

Jane: And I had a friend who worked in healthcare advertising and so crazy jane went and interviewed for a job at a healthcare advertising agency. 

Tara: Wow. 

Jane: I know. I were at supply side. 

Tara: Oh, 

Jane: I know.

So I absolutely loved that. That was a huge learning experience. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: Working with strategic planners, working with creatives, understanding the creative process, pitching, communications, huge adrenaline rush. I think there was a year where we won 15 pitches or something. I could be wrong.

It was crazy. Absolutely [00:08:00] loved it. But it gave me the opportunity to work with a number of different organizations. So I had a range of clients. And I could look from the outside in at their cultures. 

Tara: Yes. 

Jane: Their ways of working at their marketing teams and sales teams and how they operated. And that taught me a lot.

So I think it was probably four years there. And one of my clients had a vacancy that was 3M. And here we all are. So yes. I accepted a role at 3M, sales and marketing. Something like seven years later I was general manager for healthcare. Crazy. 

Tara: Wow. 

Jane: That sounds planned again. It was not.

Tara: Yeah.

Jane: Absolutely loved my time at 3M. Look, there was certainly some speed bumps along the way, business-wise and personally. And then here we go again. Another pivot. I decided to take the leap into the not-for-profit world. So I ran a not-for-profit. That delivered home and community care services under the Australian government.

Tara: Okay. 

Jane: Very different operating environment. I reported to a board. I probably [00:09:00] saw, I spoke to the chair every week. But largely that was an incredibly independent position. Gave me a lot of autonomy. Learnt so many new skills from doing that completely different environment.

For the first time I had to worry about cash flow. Don't you love that? 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: That's a huge learning. It's a great learning. And taught myself zero and just learned so much. But there was huge business challenges there. The day I started in the role, I had coffee with the chair and she said to me, Jane you're gonna have zero revenue in two years time because all our contracts end.

Nothing like a burning platform, is that and so I learned so much from that. So, you know, do the hard things. And whew. I received a phone call about four years into that. The business was looking really good. We'd transitioned to a company limited by guarantee. We'd flipped the business model.

Huge expansion, won new contracts. I was, it was really when you just get things the way you want them. You get a phone call from a recruiter, you know how that feels. 

Tara: Oh, those awful.

Jane: You're fancy. And [00:10:00] and it was a recruiter for Roche and I went through the process for the role, Roche managing director for their diabetes care business.

Tara: Great. 

Jane: Ooh. Interesting learning. I suppose at that point in time, I didn't fit at Roche. Okay. And I'm gonna be really honest. That roche is a great company. Been around a really long time, it's got a really established culture. I think after working for a not-for-profit in 3M and an advertising agency I realized there were red flags in the interview process that I didn't pick up on.

Tara: Okay. 

Jane: And once I got in there, I realized again, they had a business problem to solve. They, I think they lost 61% price on blood glucose monitors through the government scheme. 

Tara: Right, yeah. 

Jane: And that was my first month. That was, congratulations. Here's the problem you need to solve. Same sounding like a similar 

Tara: absolutely.

Jane: Scenario. And I loved that challenge. We took blood glucose monitors into Woolworths as an experiment. We did so many amazing things. A fantastic team. I knew I didn't fit within the culture, which [00:11:00] was a really interesting thing when you're the leader of an organization and you are considering whether you fit within that culture.

But an important learning for me and I should have listened to the red flags through the interview process. Isn't that interesting? 

Tara: It is. And is there anything that you are happy to share around that? About how people can work out from the outside culture and whether they're gonna fit whilst they're going through that interview process?

Jane: Wow, that's a really good question. I think you have to explore these roles with the idea that an interview works both ways. I'm sure you give this advice to your candidates. As well. Asking if you can meet with others within the organization, not just meeting with the senior leadership. Making sure you ask, not just questions like, so tell me about your culture.

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: You need to ask more specific questions about how they would handle certain things. Ask them about, you know what I mean? How the organization adapted through COVID. For example, you know and that will tell you a lot about how they treat their people. 

Tara: Yes 

Jane: it's a difficult thing because you're excited [00:12:00] and flattered to be interviewed 

Tara: Absolutely.

Jane: For a role. Of course you are. 

Tara: Especially at that level. You are. 

Jane: And I was humbled to be asked and I was excited by the challenge, the business challenges that lay ahead. But it's very difficult to get, you know, an understanding just when you only meet two or three people within a business. 

Tara: Of course.

Jane: So if I'm doing it on the other side, it's coffees. Yeah. It's meeting with multiple members of the team and it's starting to understand who they are as a person. Not just what skills and attributes they bring. So you want that cultural fit so hard. But, you know, I wish I'd listened to my gut.

I think that's, what I would say is I knew something wasn't right. And it was only when I got into the business that I went, this isn't me. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: There we go. 

Tara: And your gut had told you that before, and that's something that you've learned now through those sorts of process.

Jane: Such a funny thing. But I really wanna be honest with you and say Roche is an amazing organization. 

Tara: Yeah. Yep. 

Jane: It just wasn't mine. It wasn't a fit. 

Tara: That's . 

Jane: And I'm sure people who worked with me would understand that when they're hearing this now. And [00:13:00] I'll be honest with you, I'm still in contact with many of those people.

Tara: Right.

Jane: I've maintained those relationships. So, I suppose that led me to Cardinal Health. So again, I'll be five years in the role soon. I can't believe how quickly that's gone. And to go back to your earlier question I did eight interviews with Cardinal Health. 

Tara: Okay. 

Jane: You understand how it works at this level.

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: I did eight interviews and I was interviewing with the then Global Head of the quarter business. His name's Pat Holt. And I was talking with him about the role and he made the statement, he asked me a question about what my career aspirations were. And I said, oh, look, pat, when I'm 80 I wanna be running the local bowls club.

And after he finished laughing, he said to me, Jane, he said, what I tell my team is, after they've spent time with their family and their sport and their community, whatever's left is what they bring back into the business. 

Tara: Wow. 

Jane: And that was the point that I went, 

Tara: but shit, 

Jane: But, that told me so much about who he was [00:14:00] as a senior leader ,how he felt about his team and the importance of that within the culture.

So can you under 

Tara: That tells your culture? Yeah, that does. 

Jane: There we go. So at that point I thought, Ooh this might be the company for me. And that's continued. Some people describe Cardinal Health's culture as collegiate. We're an American organization. So I think that has meaning behind it.

And I'd say that's absolutely genuine. You can speak with your authentic voice, I certainly do. And I think there's a, it's quite consistent across the organization, even among the very senior leaders in the business. I hear the way they speak. I see the way they operate. I see how they prioritize people within the business, sense of humor.

And all of those things I think are what keeps me engaged as a leader. And hopefully that flows through, you know, to my team and the influence that I can have on others. 

Tara: That's brilliant. Thank you so much for being so transparent and sharing all of that, Jane. 

Jane: Well, it feels like a long story

i'm sorry [00:15:00] about that. 

Tara: But, there's so much I wanna ask about that story, so I'm gonna dig into some of that. 

Jane: Okay. We haven't talked about not-for-profits though. 

Tara: No.

Jane: Because we've only talked about my paid roles. 

Tara: Yes. 

Jane: Isn't that interesting? So over the course of that time, I have been, vice president for a community transport organization, five years president for a childcare.

I finished up in June as vice president for the MTAA. I've had a number of unpaid roles 

Tara: Yes. 

Jane: Within there as well. And the only thing I would add, and I know I've gone on and on at this point, is that I've learned more from those than I have from my paid work. 

Tara: Talk to me about that. 

Jane: Wow. Oh, board roles.

Fantastic opportunity to understand strategy, risk, governance, people influence culture and give back purpose, if that makes sense. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: The purpose in the vision that's so important to organizations, understanding how that's set, how to manage those challenges at a board table.

Diversity of [00:16:00] opinion, communication. Wow. I've taken away so much and for many of those roles, I've sat on boards with people who don't share my background. Yep. Who come from a variety of different perspectives, all passionate about what it is that they're trying to achieve. And I hope that from that I've been able to crystallize some ideas and some thought processes of how to bring that back to my organization.

And what I hope to achieve from that I don't know that I've said that as gracefully as I hoped. 

Tara: No, but it's 

Jane: To, I don't know that I've encapsulated that, but I really want to impress upon anyone who's considering taking on a not-for-profit role. Or a volunteer role that you just, while you're giving to the organization, you get so much better.

Tara: Yeah. let's ask a bit about that, Jane, because at what stage of your, like I do a lot obviously in the executive search space, and often I'm helping people at, I call it D Suite to C-Suite, so it might be a lot of directors, and then the next step is maybe a GM and then it's MD, then [00:17:00] C-Suite, let's say, or VP of APAC or whatever it might be.

At what point in your career did you start to look at these sort of like board positions and ways of getting this additional experience? 

Jane: Wow. It starts by volunteering. 

Tara: Yeah. 

Jane: It starts on, I don't know, for some people it's on the side of a rugby field. Where you're standing with another passionate parent or individual you share an interest in your sport or your school community or whatever it is.

A shared interest. And I suppose for me in this, going all the way back to work ethic here. An opportunity arises, someone asks and you say Yes. And I appreciate for many people they have busy lives, but you make space for these things. And then all of a sudden, instead of just volunteering on the sideline, you're doing something else and then something else.

And then there's the shoulder tapped, say, would you be interested? And it grows from there. You have to be very careful about selecting board roles. 

Tara: Okay. 

Jane: I do want to impress upon [00:18:00] asking the right questions. Certainly do the AICD company directors course. Yeah, I absolutely recommend that.

Tara: Okay. 

Jane: They have some really good advice on selecting board roles, 

Tara: do they, 

Jane: and finding, you know what I mean, the right role for you. But when you find that right role, I would say it's a wonderful opportunity to learn and to grow as well as give back. 

Tara: As well as give back. 

Jane: Yes.

Tara: I think that's the really interesting thing.

I was running a round table recently and our guest speaker said, who is on a lot of boards and has created this incredible career for themselves, said you've built so many skills through the corporate industry. Yes, we're in healthcare and medical, so we're very lucky that we all are giving back, but take those skills to charities, take those skills to people that need it.

But as you've just said, there's skills that you've then learned and been able to bring back 

Jane: Absolutely. 

Tara: Into your executive positions. 

Jane: And most not-for-profits are just so excited at the thought of having someone if you have a legal background or a financial background, hr, whatever it is. They're very happy, assuming of course it meets their [00:19:00] needs. 

Tara: Yes. 

Jane: And Their board fit their board matrix. Then yes, absolutely. But the secret is you get as much back. 

Tara: Yeah. 

And I think if I meet up and coming they're at their middle management level. And they're saying to me, oh, there's only limited opportunities, you know, for me here within this organization.

I think they're just thinking in one line, 

just that 

Jane: it's very linear. When they could be growing. And gaining experience in governance and strategy and risk through a parallel career path. 

Tara: I love that 

Jane: It doesn't impact their current trajectory, their day job, if that makes sense. I think they're missing an opportunity.

I really do. 

Tara: I love that. Jane, I think you've, that is just such great advice, and I think, again, every time I interview someone on my podcast or talk to people in your position, what I'm blown away by is, your learning is your responsibility. Not one of you have ever said, my company didn't give me this, or My company didn't give me this.

And I have those conversations and the people that [00:20:00] go out there, they find it, they find the course, they find the opportunity to learn and grow are the ones that will do well. Not the ones necessarily asking for a management title. 

Jane: Oh, look. It, the only person's responsibility is your own, 

Tara: Obviously.

Jane: Talking with your manager is important. 

Tara: Yeah. Of course. 

Jane: Everyone says, oh, I'm too busy. I love that. Look, of course I'm in a role that, you know, involves travel and long hours. So the way I've approached it now for many years is I choose one thing. So I have a year off. I had a year of quality where I went and did an ISO leadership course.

I've had a year of governance, i've mentioned the A ICD leadership course. I've had a year of privacy and cybersecurity. Now, I don't need to be an expert in those things. I don't. I'm blessed to have amazing subject matter experts that I work with on the leadership team and throughout the organization.

But as a senior leader, do I have the ability now to ask the right questions to get to the nub of the problem? I hope I do. But I've chosen one thing a year. What does that mean? Do I always do a long formal [00:21:00] course? No. Do I sometimes select a range of breakfast sessions, podcasts, reading. So I have a year of, if that makes sense.

Tara: Yeah. I love that. 

Jane: This is the year of ai. I bet it 

Tara: I bet it is. Me too, Jane. 

Jane: Oh my God. It's my year of ai.

It's the year of ai. But I think it's so important to prioritize your own learning. And I think the idea if you're a marketer, you should never stop learning. There's so much happening.

If you're in sales commercial excellence, the evolution of technology, what our customers are expecting. Innovation. It never stands still. So why are you, but I do think it's important for people to prioritize it, but lean into what they're passionate and interested about.

you can't force yourself to, if you don't, if you're not interested in it, move on. 

Tara: Find the other thing, 

Jane: find something else that suits you. But it feeds me and my level of curiosity and interest and look there's never a moment where I'm not picking up a book or listening to a podcast and taking on something new.

There we go. 

Tara: I love that. Jane, just let's [00:22:00] go back into your career history. 'cause there was a couple of things you said that I'd like to dig into, if that's okay. So you talked, there were two things you said around during one particular position, there were personal things. 

Jane: Yes. 

Tara: And then you've also said in every single position, a challenge to solve. 

Jane: Of course.

Tara: Now, again, hiring at this level a lot that 

if there wasn't a challenge to solve, we wouldn't need to be hiring someone. 

Jane: Right. 

Tara: So there's always a cha 

Jane: I probably wouldn't take the role 

Tara: and you wouldn't find that interesting. But I wanna get inside the mindset of someone that knows they can come in and work through and work out the challenge.

Like, what is it, how do you manage yourself to do that? I don't know if that's the right question, but 

Jane: well, it certainly doesn't start out that way. So I mentioned China. And that was incredibly challenging. I remember arriving in China. I was in my late twenties. You know, I had two suitcases.

I was in a hotel room. I didn't know where I was gonna live. Hadn't found us a apartment yet. I remember going to, it was my first week [00:23:00] on the job. I went to research groups and I was sitting on the other side of the glass with my team, the marketers and the advertising agency. They spoke a little bit of English.

I spoke none. I spoke no Mandarin at this point. Yeah. And on the other side of the glass, Chinese locals talking about their athlete's foot. Really? I can't make that up. It was a research group. And I remember sitting on the other side of the glass thinking, I'm accountable for this. And it just absolutely overwhelmed me like a wave.

I went back to the hotel room, sat on the floor and rocked, and cried. And then I got up the next day and I just kept going and I found a Mandarin teacher who came to my home and I just gritted it out. I was working seven days a week. It was incredible experience. I absolutely loved it, but man, it was hard.

And I've talked about other roles coming in and the challenges that they bring. 

Tara: Just that bit. Just go back to that bit because 

Jane: Sure. 

Tara: Some people would get overwhelmed and they'd be overwhelmed. What do you do after you've cried and rocked, what is [00:24:00] it that made you then go I need to go find Mandarin teacher, I need to, what do you. Is it that work ethic piece? What is it? 

Jane: There's a bit of grit in there. And again, thanks mom and dad. There is grit in there and I hope I'm teaching that to my son. The level of independence and grit, but I wasn't going to let it beat me. I think as each challenge comes along, the more you do, the more you know, that you know it's not gonna kill you.

And the more you run it, the next one, if that makes sense. You get up, you dust yourself off and you just keep going. I dunno how to explain it. 

Tara: No. It, but it's grit, 

Jane: the more often you do, the easier it becomes. I think people run away from hard things. I think you need to run at them, which is an odd thing to say.

Right. But I think it, it's important to run at the difficult thing. I've probably recognized in time that I don't celebrate success often enough. 

Tara: Okay. 

Jane: I've won, you know what I mean? Some amazing pieces of business. I'm thinking back to the Not for profit, 

Tara: a world just recently. I wanna talk about that later.

Jane: But, you know I've high fived to the team in the hallway, and then we've looked at each other and [00:25:00] gone, next. You know, how are we gonna do this? What's the next tender we're gonna win? Where are we gonna go to with this? How are we gonna expand? You know, how are we gonna hire 25 people in order to do that?

You know, you jump immediately to the next problem. And I think, yes, there's some resilience in that, but I think that you have to understand yourself, how you're motivated. Your own self-care. I don't know that I have all of the answers on that one, but I would advise people to do the hard things, and the more you do, the easier this gets.

Tara: Yeah. So that's a really important thing that you just said there. Knowing yourself, what self-care is for you so that you can have the grit and the resilience. What does it feel like? How do you dust yourself down and how do you think to yourself again? 

Jane: Look I'm not very good at it if would I've hit the wall.

I have, I think you have to know just before you hit the wall. I'm very fortunate. I have amazing friends and family who keep an eye on me. Try and find balance in life. I think, here a lot of people ask the work life balance question, and [00:26:00] I just don't think that's even a question. I just don't.

I think it's all one thing. And certainly life. There's, it's life. 

Tara: It's life, life. 

Jane: And look, there's books and books read on this, but there's no line, you know, between me being mom and me being vice president, it's the same thing. My son sees me work. He's involved in decisions that I make.

So is my husband. This is the real world, right? 

Tara: Yeah.

Jane: I think i've learned over time, I think, to listen more to my needs. You were referenced before when I was at 3M, I dealt with, I suppose a different kind of challenge. So my financial controller for healthcare passed away suddenly.

Oh, so I can remember exactly where I was, what I was doing on the Friday. We, his name is Emen Murfati. And on the Friday we'd had a pretty difficult meeting with the head of International at the time. I remember quite distinctly the way them, but the meeting went, I remember his words, Jane.

I don't care how good a leader you are, you've gotta hit this growth. Yep. And I [00:27:00] remember walking with Iman down to the coffee machine on the ground floor, and I remember the conversation we had, which was, we can do this together. What I didn't know is on the Saturday he played soccer.

He had a massive heart attack on the soccer field and passed away. His wife now does amazing work in to ensure that there's defibrillators on the sideline for sport. Yeah, there we go. Now, what happened after that? I remember where I was when I got the phone call on Sunday morning, I remember hitting the floor of the kitchen when Joe, who was head of HR rang me and he said, Emen's had a heart attack.

And I said, is he all right? You can see how this goes. Right? And then I went into machine mode Monday morning, I'm in machine mode. We're bringing in counsellors we're sorting out the business. People were devastated . I remember walking to the funeral at Macquarie Cemetery from three 3M's offices.

I remember walking with hundreds of people. I remember just the team were just, I have no words. Here's what I didn't do. I didn't prioritise me. And it was [00:28:00] probably about six months later that I realized that I just hadn't processed that properly. And I don't know that I ever really dealt with that.

That's an odd thing to say. And I can maybe reflect now in hindsight, many years later, that's why I took the move to the not-for-profit. Isn't that interesting? 

Tara: Yes, I makes sense. 

Jane: I now know that. The importance the priority that you need to place on people and family and wellness and while I was quick to consider the needs of the team first, at that time, I didn't really look after myself. That's many years ago. Now people who are listening to this, who know that story. Will have their own personal reflections on what happened at the time. 

Tara: Yes. 

Jane: And there's wonderful individuals who pulled to give up as a family, as a team.

And I'm so proud of them. But but I look back on that time now and I think, wow!. You know, I really should stopped and thought more about the impact it had on [00:29:00] me. But it certainly changed me as a leader. There we go. 

Tara: So it's, so from that, I know that was a hard one to talk About, what we were. 

Jane: But it's real. This is life. This, happens in business and you, don't just get to sweep this stuff under a carpet. 

Tara: And they say, don't they? You hear it all the time or you've, you know, put the life oxygen mask on before. 

Jane: Yes. And you do.

Tara: And you don't think about what that means until you haven't done that. And then you reflect and go, you cannot lead all without breaking down if you don't do that first. 

Jane: There's a vulnerability in that. you're not a machine. No. Obviously. And, you know, I didn't pretend that I wasn't devastated.

Of course not. But there was so many of the team that just simply did not know how to cope. That, you know, they were young. And you know I can't imagine what it was like for his family. And he has had two young children incredible. Imagine what it was like for, you know what I mean?

His soccer team, his mates. So I don't wanna make sound selfish or 

Tara: No. 

Jane: About this or to take a centralized, a myopic [00:30:00] view of this. I certainly don't wanna minimize the impact on others. Because it impacted hundreds of people. but it was a moment in time for me and many lessons came out of that.

Tara: Yeah, thank you so much for being vulnerable and sharing that with us, because I think everybody will have things that have happened. 

Jane: Of course. 

Tara: And I think that's sort of the next thing that I want to talk to you about is have there been, that's a significant experience, you know, negative one in your life that you've had.

Are there other significant steps in your career that have led you to the sort of leader, that you are now and the culture that you create for your team now? 

Jane: Wow. That's a really big question. It's a big, it's a really big question. Who am I now? I'm certainly more confident than I was as a younger leader.

I'm more confident in my own voice. I speak plain. Have you noticed I speak plain? Maybe I just don't have time. I think I thought when I was a younger leader or I was new to leadership roles, that I needed to [00:31:00] be someone else, that I needed to sound like someone else. As a female leader where I was often the only female in the room, I think I thought I needed to be more like them.

That, that's crazy, right? And I remember receiving advice very early on when I had a young baby. I had a baby when I was sitting on a largely male only leadership team. And I remember being told not to make them feel uncomfortable. By talking about, I remember getting this advice.

No, really. And and to make sure that the conversation, it was something that they were comfortable about. So something that had happened in sport on the weekend, for example. Really. And I remember that. Goodness. It just feels like such a long time ago. 

Tara: It really does. 

Jane: But you know, time has moved on and there's more senior female leaders.

So this is good. but I know my voice has changed over time. I know. I speak now with my authentic voice. I know, i'm honest, i'm transparent. I'm probably more direct now. . Goodness me. That's a good and a bad thing. I have to be very careful with that. But if people ask for feedback, I give feedback.

Because I know how important [00:32:00] feedback is I have to make sure that people are ready to receive that kind of feedback. but I was very nervous about that early on. And over time, the more I've used my own voice and the more direct I've become, the more I've noticed how people respond to that.

And what the impact is of having that kind of voice for others. I know what kind of difference that makes. And so I think I'm much more comfortable and confident in my own voice. so you ask what kind of leader I am. I hate the word authentic, but it comes up all the time.

But I hope I bring a diverse group of individuals together. I hope I build cultures, first. Change, have you noticed that is I like the idea of not change for change's sake, but change is continuous improvement. When I come into an organization, I have a couple of questions I tend to ask. I say, okay, what do you want me to fix?

What's, you know, what's wrong? You know what I mean? What's the major issue that you're facing? I ask people that question, but then I say to them, okay, what do you really value about this [00:33:00] business? What do you love? Tell me what that is and then I won't touch that. That's something that I'm gonna leave.

You know what I mean? Are we gonna set aside?. So they're the sorts of questions I ask as I come into a business fresh when I'm meeting people for the first time, but I love change for continuous improvement. and so I think if I look back on my career and I look who I am now as a leader, I think that's what I bring a sense of energy, progress, change, culture.

Did I love that. Did I try and answer? 

Tara: That was beautiful. 

Jane: It was a very big question. I dunno whether I covered it all. 

Tara: I think you articulated that beautifully. Along the way other than Ronald McDonald, have you had any, have you had any specific mentors or you don't need to necessarily mention names unless you're comfortable, but, or influences your parents, obviously definitely one, but that have kind of shaped this journey.

Jane: Sure.

Tara: Or people that you remember where you think, that was such a great piece of advice. 

Jane: Absolutely. Can I include sponsors in there [00:34:00] as well? Yeah, absolutely. And I still have many of those today. I've employed coaches and mentors along the way, different coaches and mentors at different times in my career, depending on what I needed.

When I first, became general manager at 3M I asked for a male coach. specifically I said I want a male coach because I had a specific need. When you're briefing that person, however you are paired with them, it's about understanding what it is that you're trying to achieve from that.

And usually when I'm in that position, I'm asking to be challenged. if they're good, then they're not telling you what to do, but they're asking you the sort of questions that make you feel uncomfortable. you know, the ones you don't wanna ask yourself, but you really know you should. so I've had a range of different coaches and mentors.

Through, certainly through my entire career. i've been involved certainly for the last four or five years now with the MTAA's mentoring program, as a mentor. And I can say this, I learned just as much about being a [00:35:00] mentor because all of a sudden you're giving, you know what I mean?

You're asking someone else those questions. . And then in the back of your mind, you're thinking, oh am I actually living that?. So I've enjoyed that as an experience, but I'd absolutely encourage anyone to, you know, reach out and seek mentoring sponsorship, but know what you're getting yourself in for and be prepared.

If you're really doing this, if you're really intentional about it, make sure you are asking that person to make you feel uncomfortable. 

Tara: Yeah, okay. Now can I dig into that a little bit again, because I do get asked this a lot. Obviously I know about the MTAA program 'cause I'm being mentored.

Jane: Great. 

Tara: And I've been a mentee and mentor on there this year, which has been great. 'cause I heard you talk about that at the beginning of the year. What about if people aren't part of the MTAA or then, or it's not even in the med device industry or they're just looking for a different mentor, how would you advise that they go about finding a mentor or a coach?

And there is a big difference through mentors. 

Jane: Oh, I think there is as well. And sponsors. 

Tara: Let's talk about [00:36:00] sponsors too. 

Jane: Okay. So sponsors are incredibly important. They're the influential people within your organization usually who will help give you the right advice and guidance, but they're there to give you that nod for the next role.

And in this level of leadership. Usually it's a shoulder tap by the time you're getting to my level. And you're on a succession plan and you need those people to represent your brand when you are not sitting at the table. Mind you, that also leads us to a conversation on what is your brand?

What do you want to represent within the business? What do you want people to say about you behind your back? So there's, 

Tara: we'll talk about that. 

Jane: There's that. We can come back that one. so it's sponsors. In terms of mentors and coaches, you can go outside your organization, you can find them within your organization.

There are a variety you can certainly pay. You know what I mean? There are some amazing, coaches out there. that deliver in particular areas. Depending on what you're looking for, there can be people that you admire. Yeah. I would sometimes advise, depending on what you're looking for, that you find someone who's not [00:37:00] like you.

Wow. Because and this goes for hiring as well. Don't hire a group of people who think like you and have ev a bunch of Yes. Men and women sitting around a table. You wanna hire for diversity. So you want a coach or a mentor that's not like you, that's maybe gonna ask you the hard questions.

Yeah. Reach out to that individual. Many people, if you reach out to them on LinkedIn, and I know this is a hard thing to do. but sending someone a message on LinkedIn to say, look, I met you at a conference, like conferences that we've been to recently. I was really curious about what you said.

Would you be available for a coffee? Sometimes you have that coffee and you think, oh, yep, this is going somewhere. We have some pico. Yep. We can talk. Otherwise you just go, thanks very much. That was great. Go on to the next coffee. But it's odd. I've met many individuals that way. You cross paths either through organized programs like the NCAA one. paid coaching relationships. your organization may offer that within your business or simply just go about doing it for [00:38:00] yourself. There we go. But I, you are not necessarily going to have the same coach or mentor throughout for maybe more than a year.

Sometimes it just runs its course. but be intentional about what it is. Are you in a rut? You know what I mean? Are you returning from parental leave and you're feeling like you've lost confidence? Yeah. Do you have a manager that you just, you're not seeing eye to eye with? Different problems at different points in time.

Know what that problem is, and then be intentional as to what you're seeking from that coaching relationship. And then know when it's ended. shake hands, move on. stay friends. 

Tara: Brilliant advice, Jane. Thank you. So, Jane, you've had an incredible career so far and you've experienced lots of different things and different settings and for different purposes. I'm sure along the way there's been some setbacks and some really hard challenges outside of what you obviously shared before. Can you share when these have happened as awful as they seemed at the time, what perhaps lessons you've learned from them?

Jane: [00:39:00] Wow. Well, look, I think risk taking is important. Okay. Risk and opportunity go hand in hand, particularly when you're talking about strategy. And if you're not prepared to take risks, then there's not continuous improvement. Yeah. Yeah. Particularly when you're talking about real strategic risks that are going to lift your business from A to B or z.

So I think you have to accept that is certainly as a leader, that's part of your role is to take risks. And if you're not taking risks, why are you there? Why are you being paid? So I think there, there's that aspect with that and with innovation comes failure.

And accepting failure. And being okay with that. But it's not really failure, is it? It's a learning. so the answer to your question is yes, of course I make mistakes every day. I own them and then I move on. in my role, and many other leaders would say the same thing. You sometimes have to make decisions based on incredibly limited information in a timely fashion. when it comes to sometimes, [00:40:00] short term critical decisions. And I can look back on them years later and think, wow, I wish I'd known then what I know now. But of course you must make a decision. and so you have to accept that there's risk. You do. decisions also are never as black and white as they appear to be.

And, in my role, particularly when it comes to decisions relating to people, . It's not a black or white. It isn't. And there's an opaqueness to these decisions. Often people on the outside are looking in, drawing judgment on them when they really don't know the full story. And I would say, and I've learned this again over time, that there's decisions that are correct and then there's decisions that are right.

And knowing the difference between the two. And so now, over time, I think I used to be the sort of leader that made correct decisions based on data. I'm now leaning more into what is right. And of course there's policies and procedures within every organization for when to make the right decision.

There's [00:41:00] frameworks for these things. But I would advise all leaders to reach out to subject matter experts. So, in the case of a lot of decisions, I don't make those decisions alone. Of course. Sometimes I have to make the captain's pick. I get that. or the accountability always sits with the leader.

I understand that as well. Yeah. But of course, I reach out to legal I've got a hotline to ringing legal, HR communications, my other senior leaders within the organization. I'm really fortunate that I have such open relationships with leaders in other countries.

I can ring other regional leaders and say, Hey, what do you think? And get advice before we make those kinds of decisions. But absolutely lean on others. For those decisions. But then when you make a decision, stick with it. and move on and then let it go. If you carry those decisions like a weight for the rest of your career, if you can't get, can't live with regret.

You simply can't. and look, every time I leave a role, I'm sure there's people who look back and say, what was Jane doing? Signing that contract [00:42:00] of it? It was correct at time of writing. and you must simply move on. and I mentioned this very quickly just now, but when you're a leader or a board director within an organization, and this is true for most things, you are accountable for all decisions that are made within the organization.

You are, now, they happen sometimes, and there's a decision being made right now in Melbourne or in Shanghai, and i'm not there to make that decision, but I trust and hire the right people within the organization. We work really hard on building a culture of transparency, of doing the right thing.

And so I lie straight in bed at night knowing that those decisions are being made around me every day. But when someone in the organization makes a mistake and when something goes wrong, I'm accountable. , I know that. I understand that. That's a part of my role I've learned to accept. I don't love it all the time, if I'm honest.

But this is what we're paid to do. 

Tara: Yes. 

Jane: So it's a responsibility that all leaders need to understand whether they like it or not. It's a [00:43:00] responsibility. And so I take that very seriously and I make sure that when someone comes into the organization, they understand how we operate, culture of transparency, doing the right thing, ethics, it's so important to me to get that right and hire the right people.

Tara: Yeah, of course. 

Jane: As I mentioned. 

Tara: Yeah. Well, if you. Needing to put trust in everybody. You need to hire the right people. Right. 

Jane: So difficult.

Tara: And just going back to that, that would've been a journey in itself, learning to accept that you've got to make a decision and some will be right and some will be wrong, and you gotta let it go.

Like, do you remember the turning point at which you'd like, just learn to accept and move forward? 

Jane: Wow. I don't know that there was a point in time. 

Tara: It's gradually. 

Jane: If that makes sense. it's probably happened gradually over time. do I live with regret over a contract decision?

Not usually. Sometimes I can reflect on conversations I've had with people in the learnings I've had with them and maybe what state of mind I was. 

Tara: Yes, definitely. That's, yeah 

Jane: I can go from a really tense meeting or a [00:44:00] difficult decision to a coaching scenario. You walk downstairs, you go to the photocopier, they don't know that you've just been in a heated management operating committee meeting and you bump into someone at the photocopier two seconds of conversation.

I know how powerful and dangerous that can be. and you say two things and then you walk away and you think, oh, that didn't come out the way I intended. Now the most important thing to do at that point in time is to recognize that moment and then pick up the phone. As soon as you can or go and find that person and just say, look, that didn't come out the way I intended.

I'm really sorry. And bounce back from that. But own it. I remember those moments in my career. I remember those conversations. Usually there are moment in time, if that makes sense. What have I learned from that? I've learned that when you're moving from, those moments and recognizing in and of yourself that maybe you're stressed.

Or you've gotta make a difficult decision, then make sure that you are not having those one-on-one. remove yourself from the situation until you [00:45:00] are ready for that moment and to give all of yourself to that coaching or that one-on-one moment. And if you are not ready, remove yourself. Push that meeting out.

It's so much better than going in with the wrong mindset. Because of course, there's lots going on in my head at any one point in time. that doesn't sound great the way it comes out, but that's the truth of it. You can't just, you can't move meeting to meeting.

Tara: No. 

Jane: You've gotta be honest about your feelings and how you are translating that. But do I regret the business decisions that I've made? No. No. But do I think sometimes about what I've said? Yes, I do. and I've learned now, as soon as I know that it wasn't right to apologize immediately and loop back in and own it.

I hope I've done that. I really do. I hope I've recognized those moments. 

Tara: Yeah. I love that Jane. 'cause you're right, that is something all leaders deal with. There's things you're dealing with that other people don't know and you've gone into another conversation, didn't give yourself the time, and you walk out and you're like, oh, I should have just worked from home today.[00:46:00] 

But I love that you've made it an intentional thing to loop back and have those conversations. I probably need to call my whole team after this. 

Jane: I'm sure 

Tara: I've done that 10 times this week. 

Jane: Look, you wanna give your best self. and I also know sometimes, particularly in this current role, I might only get five or 10 minutes with an individual. I better make it count.

I better make it good. 

Tara: 'cause it means a lot to that person, that interaction and 

Jane: Oh, and I've You been on a call till midnight. 

They don't know it. 

And it's not their problem. No, it shouldn't be their problem. . But I need to turn up for those moments.

So that it's so important to recognize when you're not in the right head space. 

Tara: Yeah. Yep. That's the biggest takeaway there. I love that.

So you've talked about obviously having a great team around you is absolutely critical in being able to make these, very difficult decisions sometimes.

And to be able to improve healthcare and do everything that you're doing. But it's hard, how do you, are there any tips for other leaders out there that you could give around? How do you [00:47:00] attract and decide if they're the right people for your team and then retain? 

Jane: Well, , look, I definitely would encourage anyone to open up the interview process to multiple layers within the business.

Love doing that. Meet with the team, the people you're going to work with. I love coffee interviews, getting people outside of a traditional interview space you get 'em to relax. . By the time the interviewee gets to me, usually they're at the end of the process.

And so I like disarming them, which sounds a bit naughty, but generally by the time they've reached me, we've gone through all the skills and attributes. We've gone through that stuff. 

Tara: You've done all that cool stuff. 

Jane: Yeah. So I try to unpick them a little bit and get them to relax.

I make them talk about family and sport and often, and I had someone in India say this to me recently. I interviewed someone for a role in India, which, they were successful. And he said to me afterwards, Jane. I ended up telling you all of stuff that I didn't intend to tell you. And I I said to him, that's the whole point.

The whole point of it was that I got you to relax. 'Cause anyone can [00:48:00] fake the normal interview, the standard questions. I wanna get to know who you are as an individual and what makes you tick. And then when they start talking about what they've done on the weekend, you can actually see them physically relax.

You can see their face light up and them open up and away you go. And then you get a real insight as to who they are and how they speak with their authentic voice. That gives me a much greater sense of who they are as a person. Look, of course. You can teach anyone the skills. No one comes into a role at our organization knowing everything.

No, we can teach them. processes, products, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah. But it's the values and attributes that they bring. And so that's why the interview process is so important. But I do understand you must know this, you do lots of interviews, how challenging it is to really make sure that you've got the right person for the right role.

And yes, I literally, I do, I try and disarm them in an interview. 

Tara: That's great. . 

Jane: I'm giving away my secrets. 

Tara: I know you are. 

Now they're gonna know that 

Jane: Everyone's [00:49:00] gonna be prepared for that when they meet you next. No, that's great. That's really good. 

Tara: And then, you've talked a lot about how you develop yourself, which is inspirational.

I'm sure your team see it. Like you say, you don't really want people coming in with all the skills they need for that job. They'll get bored really quickly. You want people to be challenged. So how do you go about developing your team, what you can share anyway? 

Jane: Sure. So look, what I would say as a leader, and you tapped into this, is you can never be good at everything.

So higher, complimentary individuals around you. Of course I don't have a legal background. So make sure that you have the best subject matter experts. Around you hire for diversity. again, when it comes to, learning, and development, I think you have to do things that you enjoy.

Be passionate about those things. You can't force learning. It's like saying to someone, collaborate or be in innovative. It doesn't work like that. so usually it's about tapping into an individual's interests. How they learn different learning styles. Of course there's courses, but, some of my team, particularly I'm thinking of the younger [00:50:00] individuals, they just don't learn that way. It's much more experiential now. we talk about the gig economy. We have gigs within Cardinal Health. where you can become engaged in different projects.

That's where you see people come to life. . Because they feel like they're contributing, they're collaborating, they're working with others. I see much greater development in individuals from doing that. I guess that links also into being prepared to step outside of your job description. and I, and this is obviously difficult for some individuals, let me be really clear.

Do your job really well. do your day job well. execute on what it is that, you have been employed to deliver, but then step outside of that color, outside the lines, find ways to do, other people's explore other roles. And I would often say to people, and again, some people don't like hearing this.

They want the next role. And I say to them, actually you need to be doing some of that role 

Tara: Agreed. 

Jane: Before you get there. and I'm so blessed that I've worked for [00:51:00] leaders who have pulled me in to meetings. I think about who they are, and I think they said to me, come sit, and be part of the leadership team meeting. Or I'm away on holiday, Jane, would you sit in for me on that? And I remember those moments and I think how kind I felt. Obviously I felt out of my depth at the time, but, what I learned from that and what I experienced. And so when it came time for me to move into their role or to step up, I'd had the blessing of being able to experience a lot of that.

And I hope I'm passing that on to others. by stretching them and giving them the opportunity. But that's the truth of it. you want the next job. Yeah. I think you have to already be doing some of it or displaying the attributes of a senior leader. Before you are offered that role. 

Tara: I completely agree with you.

What trends and innovations are you seeing Jane, in the, in our industry? What are you seeing as the future of med device and med tech? 

Jane: Wow. That's a really big question. And I'm new in this role as so obviously as part [00:52:00] of this role, I now have responsibility for apac. and the geo-economic environment. I mean, was that even a word six months ago? The geo-economic environment and the pace of change is just overwhelming. I think where we've come to in the last. Year is just phenomenal. And I'm finding that really interesting because the usual economic market triggers don't seem to apply or they're not operating in the same I suppose expected way.

One thing that I'm really fascinated about is China. And the change in China and where that's going and growing. I suppose we'll call it the rise of China and the rise of Asia. You can see it in popular culture, for example, K-pop, demon hunters, music, you name it, movies. But I think we're also starting to see it in the form of our future competitors.

Look, I think there's probably a view of China and certainly I've had the great blessing of living and working there and seeing that [00:53:00] progress over 20 years. and I think we are underestimating the amount of innovation coming out of there, the size of the talent pool and, the agility.

The numbers are just staggering. And I think the next five years will be, will be very different. And I think we'll be talking more and more as China. Builds brands and reputation and we'll see them enter the market. I don't just mean in healthcare and medical devices. I think we're at a really interesting time, and I'm blessed to be in this role.

And have a view over apac. I'm really enjoying, that, that part of the learning process. 

Tara: That's awesome, 

look, you're in that big role. You've talked about all of these critical decisions you have to make if you're in an APAC role. I know you are having meetings at midnight, you are then, like you said, back at the photocopier the next day or whatever it is now, talking about AI at the water cooler, but these different things and, general life is demanding.

I don't love the term work [00:54:00] life balance because I feel like it's, everything is life. All of it's kind of blended into one. But how do you. Prevent yourself from burning out, 

Jane: please prevent. Look, I think you have to be honest with yourself. I've learned, I have tools, if that makes sense. Yeah. And look, I enjoy other aspects of my life.

I've mentioned already friends and family and other interests be that sport, music. I love live music. . And not just live music, but music in general. I know how that motivates me. I know how I can use that as a tool to, change my mental state. And so I use that. I've used it as a tool over time.

I've already mentioning, mentioned learning, and other aspects. But I find my job gives me energy. There's certain aspects of my job that don't give me energy. Yeah. But then I make sure that I balance that out. So, for example, I'm traveling next week. I'm gonna be in hospitals in Thailand.

I'm so excited about that. I'm gonna be in front of [00:55:00] customers in hospitals, in Thailand. And I love that part of my job. If I can make sure that I'm doing that, having as many coaching conversations as possible, then I can balance out my own energy at work. But when I step away from work, I have other interests, that make me the complex individual that I am.

And that is a healthy thing. I genuinely think that's a healthy thing. And you have to have goals outside of work. You've gotta have holidays, you've gotta, you've gotta set those things for yourself. I always know that I come back from a break or a good relaxing weekend. A better leader. Yeah, a stronger decision maker.

And, and much more strategic and innovative. I can't bring my best self to work if I don't manage that and manage my own wellness. So that, that's very personal, but that's different for different people. I understand that, I respect that, which is why as a leader, you must put people first and then everything else flows from [00:56:00] there.

Tara: Thank you, Jane. That's great advice. And look, I know you're doing tons at Cardinal Health and very much today with wanting to learn about you as the leader, but you've got some great and exciting projects there. Is there anything you can share about projects that you've been doing or about to do?

Any initiatives? 

Jane: Wow. So, well, we're launching, two new products at the moment. So one in nutritional delivery, which is, kangaroo Omni, the other one, in our compression portfolio, which is, Kendall Smart Flow. Both of those products come with their own advantages, , in that, they're very clinician and patient focused in terms of the value that they bring.

And I'm really excited about both of those because the r and d journey behind them is very much about listening to the needs of clinicians and delivering value, and making a difference. I know that sounds, maybe a bit too corporate, but really it's so easy to get passionate about products like that when you can [00:57:00] see, the unique value that they're bringing.

So I'm excited about that. we've spoken often, about this. So it's public knowledge. We are bringing our sustainable technologies business, here in Australia. It's easy to get passionate about that. And when we talk to our customers, and again, about. Meeting a market need. So, that's easy to get excited about.

And again, with my role in apec, I'm now, starting to work on, I guess, new business models, understanding the needs of each of the markets and what we're trying to do there. And, that's easy to get excited about when you're talking about markets like China and Korea and Vietnam and India.

There's so much, that can be done there. So yes, look, I'm very excited about the next few months and few years. 

Tara: Excellent. Jane, you've been so generous with your time and your insights and your value. Are there any final bit of advice that you would give to someone looking to follow in your footsteps?

Jane: Oh, I dunno about following in my footsteps. Following find your own footsteps. would be what I would say. I guess what I [00:58:00] would want to leave people with is. That today's email and today's crisis and inverted commas will pass and look back in three days. There'll be another one tomorrow, Monday and Tuesday after that.

But, this too shall pass. That's easy to say, but hard to do. Yeah. And so the advice I would have for people is to have the ability to reflect on that, bounce back and move on. Because if you are consumed each morning by what sits in your inbox, when you open it, you're simply not going to make the kind of progress or execute against your objectives as a, that you have for yourself and for the organization.

So I think, pausing, recovering quickly, not dwelling on things and moving on, I'd say that's really, really important. The other message I would leave for people is your own attitude to work. There's no perfect organization. Organizations aren't perfect. No, there's no perfect team. There's no perfect job.

So let that [00:59:00] go. But your attitude, your growth mindset, how you approach the work, what you do, you, these are the things that are within your control. So, focus on that. Focus on what you can achieve and be positive about that. And then I suppose the final word is having a sense of humor about this stuff.

Don't take yourself too seriously. don't take the work too seriously, obviously, particularly when we work in healthcare, there are some things you must take serious, don't get me wrong. Yeah. But if you have the right team around you, and as a team, you've had the ability to have a laugh at yourselves.

When an issue arises, when a critical issue reaches the table of your leadership team, you have the ability to trust each other. Crystallize. On a way forward, and then move on. And then go and have a drink afterwards. Go and walk for a coffee. it's so important for your own health, but also for the health of your organization and your peoples have a sense of humor about this stuff.

It's not, for most people, it's not. You know what [01:00:00] I mean? Yeah. It's not so critical. And I think people get lost in that criticality of what's in their inbox. Whatever crisis that is. There is day to day. I think you have to learn through that experience . And make sure your eyes are on the horizon, not on just the crisis that's immediately in front of you.

Or you just won't make the kind of progress within your own organization and the kind of continuous improvement that we all need to make in this incredibly dynamic environment. 

Tara: Thank you so much, Jane. I've loved today's, podcast recording with you and there's so many insights I'm taking away and I'm sure our audience too. Thank you for your time. 

Jane: Thank you so much, Tara.